This week on Helping Joe, Charlie and Tucker talk to Joe about his second go at speed dating. This time Charlie went with him, and strange but hilarious things happened leading up to and during the event. Joe has big improvements in confidence by owning his oddness, but his fashion choices are still atrocious. They dig into why his idea of trying to impress women by what he wears is ineffective and what to focus on instead to make a good first impression and attract great women.
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Joe’s Thoughts and Takeaways From This Episode:
Hey this is a running commentary of random thoughts, notes, and takeaways I had during or after this episode. – Joe
- Joe & Charlie make out with the same woman (not at the same time) during speed dating
- How to own your quirkiness and be confident not crazy
- Joe acts like Kramer at Charlie’s apartment and still has terrible fashion
- How men who compete on fashion have little else to offer women.
- What the majority of women care about when they look at your fashion
- What really matters when making a great first impression on a woman
- “The only thing that you should be ashamed of is not working hard to improve the areas of your life that aren’t what you want.”
- 5 simple questions to ask yourself so you can get to where you want to go
@1:30 – Pre-gaming before speed dating at Charlie’s place with his friend.
They make fun of me for bursting into this place like Kramer. This is completely true.
My adrenaline was running high from driving in a gokart (car2go) on the highway and I ran like ½ mile to get to Charlie’s after parking the damn thing. Charlie’s friend was probably slightly terrified when I burst into his apartment out of breath like I was running from the cops or something.
I wasn’t nervous about meeting his friend (she was cute) or about being an oddball. This was a positive. Tucker explains how if you just push through initial weirdness and act like normal after, a woman will not care that much about your craziness. Something about acting as if, like it’s normal or you don’t give a fuck, and then it’s cool.
I had a lot of fun talking to her, talking to Charlie, pulling out clothes out of my bag (like a magician), asking them for advice, and drinking. This was a fantastic way to pre-game and warm-up before going to speed dating.
@7:00 – Shirts I brought on speed dating
Shirt #1 my mythical centaur shirt.
Tucker and Charlie gave me a lot of shit for this. It’s embarrassing to say this, but I thought this was a cool shirt or nice shirt. Wrong. Again, my fashion sense turns out to be completely erroneous.
The magician bit here from Charlie was funny.
Shirt #2 is a lime green shirt.
Shirt #3 is a neutral gray striped shirt. I ended up wearing this to speed dating
@14:00 – “If Joe is confident enough to act like a complete fool and just own it, that’s a great sign.” – Tucker
This was a nice compliment that I deserve because this shows I’m growing. I acted like a crazy man and was honest about not knowing anything about style and I just kept going. I wasn’t self conscious or nervous like I usually am. This was huge. I wish I could go into every date or interaction with a woman like that, just not really giving a fuck or at least not being preoccupied with a negative internal monologue.
Charlie’s friend’s first impression of me was that I was an insane person with no style, and she stilled like me because I didn’t care and after I calmed down and was cool / normal it was great.
@16:00 – The difference between quirky and crazy
Tucker talks about how being odd or unusual or quirky is attractive to the right woman. It’s not a bad thing if you have all these other positive qualities. It’s not mental institution crazy which is about as unattractive as you can get.
Tucker’s point was just be who you are and own it to attract the right woman. This totally worked with this woman because we had a great conversation and I found out later that she really liked me.
@17:30 – “He was too exhausted and had sprinted the anxiety out of him.”
They have fun with this. Tucker was right here. Maybe I should just sprint to every date instead of drive or get an Uber. I wonder what other exercises are good (maybe yoga) for relieving tension, warming up, and “sprinting the anxiety out.”
Warming up with a drink and talking with Charlie and his friend was a great warm-up to speed dating. I should do some form of this before every date. Just warmup socially, get those muscles going.
@20:00 – We go to speed dating
I mentioned that we took an Uber to get here and I totally forgot or didn’t want to talk about how our Uber driver was a girl I matched with on Hinge but I never messaged her back when she messaged me because I took a 2nd look and wasn’t attracted to her.
I was too much of a coward to say anything during the ride so I just sat in the back, buried my face in my phone, and didn’t say much the whole ride.
At speed dating, Charlie was the guy right behind me in the circuit. So he talked to every girl I talked to immediately after I talked to her. We had a little bit of fun with this, but probably could have done a lot more funny stuff. I should have told girls “The guy right behind me has herpes. I heard him talking about it.”
@22:00 – Backstory on Charlie’s crazy friend
Charlie give a little context for the woman at his place who came with us to speed dating that night. She’s going through a hard time I think.
@25:00 – My speed date with Charlie’s friend … it got weird.
Charlie’s friend hit on me (she thought I was cute), we started making out, then she really hit me (slapped me in the face) and grabbed my neck. She said she liked 50 Shades of Gray. This was really weird. I just met her an hour ago now this bitch is smacking me (lightly, didn’t hurt). WtH is going on?
I really didn’t understand what was going on.
“If she’s initiating physical contact with you in an aggressive way, that’s what she wants back.” – Tucker
Yep that does make sense.
@28:30 – The very next chick was like Chris Farley
I move on to this woman who was drunk and hilarious. So funny. She was like a female version of Chris Farley. Fat, long blond hair, fucked up teeth, big tits, and pathetically hilarious.
Charlie goes on a speed date with his friend next. At some point in the date I turn around and now Charlie is making out with her. Gross. He totally has gingervitis now.
Tucker gave him shit for this: “You made out with her and then Charlie followed you and made out with her! Charlie, you followed not just Joe, but a ginger!” – Tucker
Charlie makes some great self-deprecating jokes: “The show should be called Helping Charlie.”
@29:30 – I impersonate Chris Farley girl and repeat what she said to me.
I had fun with this. That chick was a mess, but honest & hilarious.
@32:00 – Selfie Chick Round 2
We talked about this girl in Episode 9 and I didn’t match with her for a few key reasons that Nils and Tucker explained in the beginning of that episode. So she was there again at speed dating. This time in a very tight, low-cut black dress and heels, cherry red lipstick again.
Charlie talked about her being sad but this went right over my head or I blew past it. Listening back to this I wish I had asked them what they thought was going on with this chick. Why she was one of the more depressing girls to talk to and different from how she was in ep 9.
@36:00 – Charlie and his friend exit speed dating early
They were so drunk that they just quit the speed dating thing early, sat at the bar, and made out while the speed dating thing just continued going around them. They weren’t hammered but obviously weren’t interested anymore in event. This was funny.
@37:30 – I only matched with 1 woman
Even though I had way more fun at this event than the last one (Episode 9), wasn’t dressed like a buffoon, and had great conversations, I matched with less women. I was kind of upset about this because there were a few girls I would have liked to go out with. Tucker explains how to display that you are into her (circle her number right there) and how to hang out and ask for their number after. Next time: just go up and talk to them after.
@40:30 – After I saw them making out, I just thought about leaving.
I was ready to go. They seemed pretty into each other or at least Charlie’s friend was really into him and I didn’t want to be around watching them make out so I tried to leave a few times, they convinced me to stay and hang out.
“Joe is always looking for a reason to get away from people / pull the escape hatch.”
Yea that’s true but I didn’t want to be around as a 3rd wheel when these 2 people were drunk, very into each other, and looked like they wanted to hook up. I don’t know. I guess I just deal with uncomfortable social situations in a fucked up way, running away from them. This is a bad pattern I have.
We went to get pizza and this woman was all over Charlie. I was finally like, okay I’m eating pizza by myself next to 2 people making out, I’m outta here and I left.
@42:00 – Going from risky social situation to one that is less risky
Yea I do this a lot. I don’t know why.
“It only makes sense if you are trying to reduce your social anxiety.”
This is counter-productive and in the opposite direction of what I want to accomplish, meet women, make friends, and have fun. This is something I really have to work on.
@46:00 – Charlie’s friend got in touch with me after.
At one point in the evening, after the event was over she told me she was sorry that she made out with Charlie. Not sure she really meant it and I didn’t really care. But she did get in touch with me (texting) the next day and wanted to hang out. This when I asked Charlie about it and he gave me some advice. I would have probably gone out with her if Charlie hadn’t said anything.
Charlie talks about how to set boundaries with a friend who you don’t want to date.
@48:00 – We revisit my clothes and dig deeper into this
“You should not be in charge of your fashion decisions.” – Charlie
Yea this is stuff we’ve already talked about. I just haven’t thrown out my clothes yet.
“Standing out with clothes is the shallowest form of trying to be noteworthy… You don’t have any money and terrible aesthetic taste. So why would you worry about this?” – Tucker
Yea these are all great points. I don’t know why I still have it stuck in my head that I should wear this stuff. We talked about this for a bit. Here were a few takeaways:
1. Men compete on fashion when they have little else to offer.
2. I’m poor and have awful taste, so it’s a terrible idea.
3. It doesn’t matter that much to the women that I am going after.
“The point is not to be attractive to all women. It’s to be very attractive to some women.”
I’m still not thinking like this but being on this podcast is helping with this because I know it’s the same in marketing a business: if you are all things to all people, you are nothing to nobody; if you try to please everyone, you will please no one, etc.
“You can stop wearing stupid shit today! You can stop hurting yourself [with women]… Not dressing like an idiot is a major improvement!”
I was really thick-headed about this. Austin is one of the worst mating markets in the country if you want to compete fashion because people are more substantive here.
“The upside so minimal compared to the downside. So why worry about [fashion]?” – Charlie
Charlie calls back Episode 10 @ 50:30 where I said, “[On dates] I would try to like the things she liked so she would be into me instead of being honest and going our separate ways.” This is the same thing here.
“What’s a priority to women is that you do NOT look like an idiot.” – Tucker
@1:03:30 – How to make a great first impression on a woman
Be in shape…. I am.
Be clean, hands, skin, hair…. I am.
Projecting good energy (body language, social skills)… this is wear I need help or have to focus on
Clothings is way, way down the list… this is where I spend too much time.
@1:05:00 – What are things that you bring to the table that women value
This was a cool taking-a-step-back exercise to look at everything I bring to the table that is important to women so that I can get this fashion idea out of my head. I missed the biggest one when first listing things: Being a good person, being kind. That’s what most women all over the world want, strong & kind.
I should just write a fucking list and put on my wall somewhere because I don’t think about or acknowledge the good traits I already have, the traits that women find attractive.
“The overall thought in your head is that you have to be something fake or different to attract women… That’s a wrong idea” – Tucker
Yep, he nailed it.
@1:09:00 – Focus on your energy and your body language.
It’s better to focus on your thoughts, emotions, feelings first and they will project outwards in body language. You can’t focus on body language first. It doesn’t work that way. Yea I remember reading this in the Charisma Myth. Amy Cuddy’s TED talk is wrong. Focusing on body language directly is good for short-term but not a long-term strategy
“That will change more of your first impression more than anything you could ever wear.”
Wow, I really didn’t think about it this way. I’ve been wasting a lot of money and time on clothes when I could have been focusing on this more important stuff like this.
@1:10:30 – They read my 5 minute journal
Starting in Episode 10, I’ve been writing in a 5 Minute journal. So for the last 5 weeks or so everyday in the morning and at night I write stuff about what I’m grateful for or what went really well today, etc.
You can hear me cursing under my breath because I was really nervous about them reading this on the podcast. These are random thoughts I just kind of spill out of my brain onto a journal everyday then I forget about them. Not really the best stuff I want everybody to hear. I’ve written about Charlie & Tucker in here (grateful that I’m in Austin and that I do this show with them).
I wrote the Nepal thing before the earthquake that happened there. Now I am really fucking grateful that I don’t live there.
Unfortunately my handwriting sucks and they couldn’t really read any of this.
We talk about “I am worthy of being loved for who the fuck I am.”
Tucker digs into why I feel this way and why I’m not doing the right things to change where I am.
I have a lot of career or work anxieties. I usually feel like I’m not doing enough and I’m not good enough at what I do. And I don’t take enough significant steps to improve so I just get more anxiety about it because I know I’m not improving or learning at a fast pace.
@1:14:00 – Pericles’ Funeral Oration And Getting Stuff Done
Tucker talks about this Athenian (Greek) guy named Pericles who had this great speech and said, “There is no shame in poverty. There is only shame in not doing anything to alleviate the situation.”
“The only thing that you should be ashamed of is not working hard to improve the areas of your life that aren’t what you want. And if you aren’t doing it, you need to sit down and figure out why.”
1. What am I trying to accomplish? What is your goal? (Start small)
2. Why am I doing this?
3. What’s the measurement for when you have succeeded?
4. How are you going to do this? What is the plan? (Actions)
5. What is the accountability?
Make your actions a habit, do this everyday.
I’m already doing this with dating and Helping Joe. Now I just have to apply it to other things that matter in my life.
@1:18:00 – Update with the nurse
I give an update of texts with nurse that I blew off from Episode 14. I think she wants to go out, now I have to figure out what to do. My instinct is to go for a relaxing walk. Tucker makes fun of me for this. Charlie suggests mini-golf which actually sounds kind of fun. I haven’t done this in like 10 years. They give some good date ideas to send her. I’m probably way overthinking this. Hope this goes well.